Update 2025-10-14 (PST) (AI summary of creator comment): "Take over" is defined as controlling the government, regardless of whether this occurs through a coup or democratic process.
Islamist groups include organizations like Hamas. Currently, Tehreek-e-Labbaik is noted as the only major Islamist political party in Pakistan (less extreme than Hamas).
Update 2025-10-14 (PST) (AI summary of creator comment): If Tehreek-e-Labbaik is a small constituent of a parliamentary coalition of mostly non-islamist parties, that will not count as an islamist takeover.
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if the current army chief gets tired of being a shadow ruler and takes over the country officially, this should resolve YES @JonathanRay
you can verify his islamist inclinations, he is a noted hardliner and apparently he's memorized the Koran
@JonathanRay It sounds like he is personally religious and conservative, but in politics he is a pragmatist who advocates preservation of the existing institutions, not a theocratic state. So he would not count as an islamist.
@JonathanRay uhm check again please.
He is 100% NOT 'preserving the existing institutions'. WTF.
The civilian government is completely undermined. The Prime Minister Sharif is not able to meet major world leaders like Prez Trump alone - he is chaperoned by Munir every time. OTOH Munir is able to meet Trump 1x1.
The Supreme Court is greatly undermined. A competing pseudo-Supreme Court has been set up and the OG Supreme Court's authority and jurisdiction has been curtailed.
The most popular politician in Pakistan, the previous PM... I'm blanking on his name - the ex-cricketer.. Imran Khan. He was removed from power by Munir's military, and Khan is expected to die in jail on trumped up charges.
https://www.ft.com/content/f2b5fe2d-a386-4588-b619-bad5ce7dd199
https://shahzaibelahi.substack.com/p/the-silent-rise-asim-munir-and-the
Perhaps this is subjective - but Munir seems to genuinely believe his rhetoric.
@Hakari Most of that is not responsive to the question of whether munir is an islamist. He can be a strongman without being an islamist. Pakistan has a long history of power sharing between the civilian and military governments. Imran Khan is widely regarded as more like an islamist than munir. I went and got a second opinion from Gemini:
@JonathanRay that's an interesting distinction. In those 2 screenshots,
Promotes state-centric Islamic ideology
Says Islam is not just a faith, but the essential bedrock of Pakistani nationalism and military purpose.
Only the state has the authority to declare jihad.
These are not points AGAINST him being an islamist.
These just say (and I agree) that he's attempting to usurp/subvert the traditional position of hardline clerics in BEING islamist (calling clerics an arm of the state, the power to clarify position on islamic matters, the power to declare jihad, the power of nation building aka ~caliphate). He may well succeed in that usurpation over the local clerics. That change in management doesn't change the fact that the movement is named islamist.
It's good that the LLM mentions the 'Islamist in uniform' argument.
The LLM second image is likely just mirroring your framing where you wrapped islamist in quotes "" - which it might process as skepticism on your part and attempt to corroborate. See how in its response the LLM highlights Asim Munir's "Doctrine".
BTW would you describe the Ayatollahs of Iran as islamist?
@AlexanderTheGreater take over is defined as controlling the government. Doesn't matter if it's a coup or democratic process. Hamas certainly counts as islamist. Based on a chatgpt summary I think none of the major political parties in pakistan currently are islamist except Tehreek-e-Labbaik, which is less extreme than Hamas.
@JonathanRay Also, if Tahreek-e-Labbaik is a small constituent of a parliamentary coalition of mostly non-islamist parties, that won't count.