How far will the 3rd Starship test get before exploding?
Basic
72
59k
resolved Mar 21
Resolved
YES
Clears the launch tower
Resolved
YES
Max Q
Resolved
YES
Main engine cut-off (MECO)
Resolved
YES
Second stage engine start (SES)
Resolved
YES
Stage separation
Resolved
YES
Second stage engine cutoff (SECO)
Resolved
YES
Booster boostback burn shutdown
Resolved
NO
Second stage touchdown (hard or soft)
Resolved
NO
Booster landing burn startup
Resolved
YES
Booster boostback burn startup
Resolved
NO
Booster touchdown (hard or soft)

Each option resolves YES if the next (3rd) Starship full stack flight test completes that milestone without exploding, NO otherwise (i.e. if it explodes during or before completing that milestone).

See the flight plan at https://www.spacex.com/launches/mission/?missionId=starship-flight-3

Examples and more detailed definitions:

  • This question refers to the next Starship full stack flight test which has a planned trajectory that reaches space (100km altitude). So a 10km altitude flight test does not count.

  • "Exploding" here will include any Rapid Unscheduled Disassembly

  • The second stage and stage separation milestones only require the second stage not to explode. Similarly, the booster boostback/landing milestones only require the booster not to explode.

  • If Starship reaches MaxQ but explodes 2 seconds later, MaxQ still resolves YES.

  • MECO/SECO are defined as when the engines are intentionally shut down - if the engines shutdown unintentionally that doesn't count.

  • If MECO is attempted but the engines fail to shut down, and the rocket explodes before they can successfully shut down, MECO resolves NO.

  • Note that Starship will be doing a hot staging - they will cut off most but not all of the booster engines, ignite the second stage engines, and then the stages separate. This is different from most other rockets!

  • Note that the planned MECO will have most engines cut off, not all.

  • Second stage engine start (SES) does not require stage separation to complete successfully, as long as the engines ignite successfully. At least half the engines must ignite to count as a success.

  • Similarly, for booster burn startup, at least half the engines that are supposed to ignite must ignite to count as a success.

  • For stage separation, if the second stage separates intact, that's a YES (even if e.g. the rocket starts spinning unrecoverably out of control, as long as it stays intact). If the engines light but the second stage explodes instead of separating, that's a NO. If the stages separate unintentionally, that's a NO.

  • Second stage touchdown resolves YES if Starship touches down anywhere in the planned ocean or continent (currently planned for the Indian ocean), and is intact at the moment it hits the surface, even if it is an uncontrolled crash. If it touches down elsewhere, that's a NO.

  • Similarly for booster touchdown, resolves YES if the booster (separated from the second stage) touches down anywhere in the planned ocean or continent and is intact at the moment it hits the surface.

  • The close date is not a deadline and will be extended as necessary until the test occurs.

Previous market for IFT2: https://manifold.markets/jack/how-far-will-the-2nd-starship-test

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bought Ṁ10 Booster touchdown (h... YES

@Mqrius From the description:

  • for booster burn startup, at least half the engines that are supposed to ignite must ignite to count as a success.

  • for booster touchdown, resolves YES if the booster (separated from the second stage) touches down anywhere in the planned ocean or continent and is intact at the moment it hits the surface.

If it exploded before hitting the water that's a NO (the question is how far it gets before exploding)

As others have commented below, it looks pretty clear that both the booster landing burn startup and booster touchdown resolve NO. Any thoughts on whether to resolve now (and of course if new info comes out to contradict we would re-resolve) or continue waiting e.g. for the mishap report?

  • 13 engines were supposed to relight for the booster landing burn, and it looks like only 3 did relight, less than the half required for "Booster landing burn startup"

  • The booster had a RUD at 462 meters according to SpaceX https://www.spacex.com/launches/mission/?missionId=starship-flight-3. So it didn't make it to the water for "Booster touchdown"

@jack Both seem like no and waiting a couple of months seems a long wait. As it can be re-resolved later, I don't see any problem with resolving now.

Yeah agreed just resolve and change later if necessary

Market for the 4th test?

@esusatyo I will make it but usually I wait until we have a bit more idea of what the planned mission is.

Booster touchdown (hard or soft)
bought Ṁ100 Booster touchdown (h... YES
bought Ṁ350 Booster touchdown (h... YES

Actually yup that looks pretty convincing to me.

@Pax the comments have some questions, like is that a cloud layer and could it be a vapor cone

@jack I see thick lines that look more like water to me than anything that cloud can make. But I'm happy waiting for a more certain resolution. I myself am convinced enough to bet anyway.

bought Ṁ50 Booster touchdown (h... NO

@jack SpaceX Update:

https://www.spacex.com/launches/mission/?missionId=starship-flight-3

“Super Heavy successfully lit several engines for its first ever landing burn before the vehicle experienced a RUD (that’s SpaceX-speak for “rapid unscheduled disassembly.”) The booster’s flight concluded at approximately 462 meters in altitude and just under seven minutes into the mission.”

@Pax Interesting! Well, that seems conclusive, but I still am unclear on what exactly caused its destruction.

This should be enough to resolve to NO but I'll probably wait a bit for more confirmation.

bought Ṁ250 Booster landing burn... NO

At T+6:30 on the livestream they say that the landing burn is to start with 13 engines relighting (before going down to three). The graphic on the stream showed 3 engines lighting, and Gwynne Shotwell says in the below tweet "likely a couple of engines making mainstage" (i.e. completing startup). Seeming like the "half of engines needing to light" criterion is not likely to be satisfied for the Booster landing burn startup answer.

@chrisjbillington Thanks. Yeah, 13 makes sense, IIRC that's the same as last time - everything except the outer ring.

Will wait some more for more info, but I'm pretty confident less than half lit.

I sold out of "booster touchdown - yes" too early apparently. Isn't the booster already lost?

@HarrisonNathan We think it was lost in flight but we aren't sure.

bought Ṁ100 Second stage touchdo... NO

Payload door broke, probably gonna be an issue with structural integrity during reentry, no?

@Mqrius 🤔

...it's on the back though!

Guess we'll find out

@chrisjbillington yeah idk how much it affects things

bought Ṁ50 Booster landing burn... NO

Telemetry on booster cut out. They said it stopped just short of engine relight. So we'll have to wait and see what happened.

sold Ṁ98 Booster touchdown (h... YES

@jack a few engines lit... Does that count?

@Mqrius then it crashed into the water (hard) does that count?

bought Ṁ10 Booster touchdown (h... YES

@Mqrius From the description:

  • for booster burn startup, at least half the engines that are supposed to ignite must ignite to count as a success.

  • for booster touchdown, resolves YES if the booster (separated from the second stage) touches down anywhere in the planned ocean or continent and is intact at the moment it hits the surface.

If it exploded before hitting the water that's a NO (the question is how far it gets before exploding)

@jack Telemetry showed 3 engines lighting then 2 shutdown within a second or two and then telemetry lost showing just the 1 remaining central engine remaining lit. Do we know how many were supposed to light?

If 7 or more were supposed to have relighted is this enough to resolve no. Lighting after telemetry lost seems unlikely to me but maybe it is still possible if the telemetry loss was a minor communications matter? Given timing, more likely to have been something seriously terminal but perhaps better to wait for more detail.

bought Ṁ7 Second stage engine ... NO

Launch window coming up! Here are some more markets to bet on

bought Ṁ100 Booster touchdown (h... NO

@jack the raptor relight and reentry are our next big events!