Will mainstream news report that Prigozhin is alive and free by end of July?
72
645
1.4K
resolved Jul 23
Resolved
YES

Any news coming from any one of:

• The New York Times

• The Wall Street Journal

• The Washington Post

• ABC

• CNN

• Fox

That reports evidence that Prigozhin is not captured/imprisoned/dead will resolve yes.

Things that are insufficient to resolve yes:

• Speculation about motives of Prigozhin

• Reports of whereabouts of Prigozhin that include no evidence (anonymous sources are not considered evidence in this case)

• Hearsay. Sources that claim Prigozhin is free must provide some verifiable evidence to the claim.

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predicted YES

You say that it's verifiable evidence that he's alive and free. After reading the article, I really didn't get the sense that this was verifiable. In the article it says:

The video is grainy and filmed in low light so CNN cannot definitively say the speaker is Prigozhin or when it was filmed.

When I read that sentence, it seems like they can't confirm or are unable to verify that the speaker is Prigozhin or when it had been filmed.

If I had submitted the video, and I said to you that "I can't verify the person speaking nor the date it was filmed." Would you accept this as evidence to resolve the question?

The top half of the article is just a description of the video. The second part of the article, is what Lukashenko had told reporters on what happened. And from your comments on Lukashenko telling of what happened, it would be hearsay.

I don't see the article/video as answering the question: Will mainstream news report that Prigozhin is alive and free by end of July?

predicted NO

@higherLEVELING CNN has reported evidence that Prigozhin is alive and free. It’s that simple. There’s no other way this market could resolve.

The intent of this market isn’t about the state of Prigozhin, but about what is reported by mainstream news about him.

predicted YES

Bruh cmon.. that's a little much to add in a rule so that this can close early. you added the last thing about hearsay 43 minutes ago. and closed this 43 minutes ago.
here's what it said originally...
________________________________________________
Things that are insufficient to resolve yes:

• Speculation about motives of Prigozhin

• Reports of whereabouts of Prigozhin that include no evidence (anonymous sources are not considered evidence in this case)

Now added: • Hearsay. Sources that claim Prigozhin is free must provide some verifiable evidence to the claim.


If that hearsay wasn't added, you wouldn't be able to close as yes. It wouldn't meet the criteria to close. Last screenshot is showing that they closed after the "hearsay" line was added.

predicted NO

@higherLEVELING that is bizarre. There has to be a bug here. I edited the description 10 days ago. I even commented when I did so: https://manifold.markets/JamesRomeril/will-mainstream-news-report-that-pr#L9KpVlpVzeWY4n5bX7Uz

Secondly, the hearsay line was added to clarify some questions from @PS. It has nothing to do with how this market was resolved

The evidence reported by CNN is sufficient to resolve this market even without that line.

predicted NO

@JamesRomeril For me, edit history shows the "hearsay" phrase added around resolution time as well. This seems quite important, generally speaking, and I'd love to see this analyzed by Manifold.

For the record: I lost a small amount of mana and I wished this had resolved earlier, right after CNN showed that video. Furthermore, from the title and some comments, I got the (wrong) impression that "alive" and "free" or similar expressions might be necessary in the report for this to resolve.

That being said: It's a difficult question to operationalize, and on re-reading the description I'm confident the resolution is correct.

Meta: I prefer questions resolving to the letter of question+description as much as possible. Unpopular opinion: Resolutions against the letter of the question should be overruled by N/A-ing, unless there is an explicitely stated "resolves to my intent"-clause.

predicted NO

@Primer All I can think is that the description edit was in some kind of draft mode for 10+ days, and only when I closed the market did it get submitted? I would love someone from Manifold to explain what happened here too. I promise on my end it looked all good, only now does the history seem wrong.

The hearsay question was regarding Lukashenko claiming he was alive. There was no substance to that quote, and there was nothing given by Lukashenko that could be verified (e.g., time or place, or even how he would be in a position to know). Which is why I added that line 10 days ago. I even wrote a comment explaining that edit. But again, that has nothing to do with the resolution of this market. Without that line, it would’ve resolved the same way. 100%

I also lost mana on this question.

predicted NO

As noted in the comments, CNN has reported verifiable evidence that Prigozhin is alive and free.

This is not to say that the evidence is not faked. But it is sufficient to resolve YES.

predicted NO

@Noit I will note here that the resolution criteria I have provided makes no claim about whether the evidence provided is faked or not, merely that it’s sufficient evidence for mainstream media to report it is a given. There is no possibility that this market was mis-resolved.

predicted NO

@JamesRomeril While I think YES resolution probably makes sense, I wouldn't go far as to say it's 100% the right resolution. The CNN article https://edition.cnn.com/2023/07/19/europe/prigozhin-wagner-belarus-appears-intl/index.html did not "report that Prigozhin is alive and free" - it was extremely careful not to report that:

  • A video emerged on Wednesday that appears to show Wagner founder Yevgeny Prigozhin

  • a man resembling and sounding like Prigozhin says in the video

  • The video is grainy and filmed in low light so CNN cannot definitively say the speaker is Prigozhin or when it was filmed.

I recognize your argument that this counts as "reporting evidence", but I think others may disagree.

predicted NO

@jack You may have found wiggle room in the market title, but the description is water tight:

Any news … That reports evidence that Prigozhin is not captured/imprisoned/dead will resolve yes.

predicted NO
bought Ṁ2 of NO

@higherLEVELING Well if they don’t report at all then the answer should technically resolve to no. The negation (will the mainstream media report Prigozhin is dead) would also resolve no if there was no reporting at all.

predicted NO

@Traveel Not asking about if they dont report at all. Im asking what if its reported that his whereabouts are unknown, like the screenshot shown and article linked

@higherLEVELING I agree with @Traveel - the question reads "Will mainstream news report that Prigozhin is alive and free?" If they don't report that, it seems it should resolve No, whatever else they resolve...

predicted NO

@higherLEVELING Thanks for the clarification.

@PS Just to make sure: Any article from the media mentioned in the description claiming Prigozhin is alive and free at any point between now and the end of the months suffices for "yes" (if they are not based on anonymous sources only)?

@PS The reason I'm asking: reports like this one seem to meet the criteria. It's from CNN, quotes a specific source (Lukashenko) claiming Prigozhin is alive and at large...

predicted NO

@PS those are some good points. lets see what he says he pops back in

predicted NO

@PS The article you linked makes no such claims? Can you pull the relevant quote? Did you send the wrong link?

predicted NO

@JamesRomeril I don't know exactly which article, but would this be enough:

But Reuters reported that Lukashenko said on Thursday: "As for Prigozhin, he's in St Petersburg. He is not on the territory of Belarus."

Doesn't necessarily say he's alive or free, but that he's there. Lukashenko claims this
Mercenary chief Prigozhin back in Russia, Belarus's Lukashenko says | Reuters

Wagner Group's Prigozhin Is Back in Russia, Lukashenko Says (newsweek.com)

Wagner boss Prigozhin has returned to Russia, Lukashenko says | Yevgeny Prigozhin | The Guardian

predicted NO

@PS I can’t consider that statement as evidence, it’s clearly speculation.

@JamesRomeril Speculation as to where exactly he is, but seems a clear statement by Lukashenko that Prigozhin is alive and free.

I agree that Lukashenko isn't always a reliable source, but it seems to fit the description, which isn't about location.

predicted NO

@PS He could travel as a prisoner or corpse. I don't think this should be enough to resolve.

@AlexbGoode It's clearly not what Lukashenko means. And I agree it shouldn't be enough to resolve, but I do think it should be a reason to clarify the description/criteria for resolution.

predicted NO

@PS I can’t find anything more than hearsay from Lukashenko. I will update the description accordingly, thanks for raising this.