Sad this isn’t higher so I could bet it down :(

Trump said it, this must clearly be real

I assume this is a joke, but Trump is not a reliable source here so this does not count.

@Jessef0226 I'll put a new limit order down just for you.

This seems to be the same whistleblower as the original report, but I'm looking for additional confirmation beyond this one person to count this as confirmed.

Well he lost, so it must be rigged.

harris said hamas used rape to attack israelis on october 7 and it wasnt fact checked even though it was a lie

@JamieCrom https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181. A cursory search makes it look like this happened. (I can find records of two specific assaults that were debunked https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/how-2-debunked-accounts-of-sexual-violence-on-oct-7-fueled-a-global-dispute-over-israel-hamas-war, but that is insufficient to debunk the claim as a whole.)
Is there more to Harris' claim than what you mentioned above? Because it seems true as stated.

"Well, let's understand how we got here. On October 7, Hamas, a terrorist organization, slaughtered 1,200 Israelis - many of them young people who were simply attending a concert. Women were horribly raped. And so absolutely, I said then, I say now, Israel has a right to defend itself. We would. And how it does so matters because it is also true far too many innocent Palestinians have been killed: children, mothers. "

there is no evidence that hamas militants raped israeli women on october 7 except for the debunked second-hand accounts. it's obvious the news media is favoring harris and will never fact check her

@JamieCrom The thing is they weren't really fact checking Donny there, they were reality checking him.

They didn't go: "Hang on, this isn't technically correct, we should say something" they went "Wait a minute, that's batshit insane, we should say something."

The reason they didn't do this to Kamala is that she didn't wildly diverge from reality into crazy land.

Was she wrong about literally one (or maybe even two!) things? Was she misleading once or twice on purpose (gasp!)? Sure, but if they had actually been fact checking they would have stopped Trump 33(!) times to Kamala's one.

---

https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/07/17/questions-and-answers-hamas-led-armed-groups-october-7-2023-assault-israel

"Human Rights Watch’s investigation found evidence of acts of sexual and gender-based violence, including forced nudity, and the taking and the posting on social media, both without consent, of sexualized images. Human Rights Watch was not able to gather verifiable information through interviews with survivors of or witnesses to rape during the assault on October 7, and there is only one public account reportedly from such a survivor.

The office of the UN Special Representative of the Secretary-General on Sexual Violence in Conflict, which interviewed people who reported witnessing rape and other sexual violence, concluded that there were “reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred during the October 7 attacks in multiple locations across Gaza periphery, including rape and gang rape, in at least three locations.”"

Of course your claim that the rapes were "debunked" deserves a fact check of its own because even though some of them may not have occurred, the evidence strongly points towards at least some having occurred.

@JamieCrom Sexual and gender-based violence in the 2023 Hamas-led attack on Israel - Wikipedia
Seems like there does in fact exist evidence of this happening.

all this says is that a idf member is claiming that there exists evidence. idf is not a reliable source

@Jamie Wikipidia talks about several testimonies, forensic evidence, and conclusions by the UN. If you are going to lie about something ("all this says is that a idf member is claiming that there exists evidence. idf is not a reliable source") maybe pick a claim that takes more effort than clicking a link to verify.)

@UnconditionalProbability the link you gave qualified every bit of evidence with "according to israel police" and "according to idf" and "testimony of secondhand witness"

@JamieCrom For better or worse (definitely sometimes for worse), both parties in the US, the mainstream media, and the US government consider the IDF to be a reliable source. Even if Harris should have been called on it, it certainly wasn't a case of rigging the debate in favor of Harris (for example, Trump would also have not been called on saying the same thing). You can continue arguing about this if you want, but it's not going to be a reason to resolve to YES.

@Gabrielle Why on earth should Harris have been called on it? The UN report itself agrees with her. The idea that this is a lie is just straight up denialism of the worst kind - an inability to accept that actually bad things happened on Oct 7th, and that the world might be a little nuanced.

@SG trade?

Let's say the sample debate questions are kind of the same as the real debate questions, but in the way you'd expect given that you, like, have to ask about immigration and abortion and such,and the 'only fact check trump' thing isn't confirmed. how would you resolve this?

@jacksonpolack That would be a NO - if they’re only as similar as question that I could guess would be asked, that doesn’t seem like rigging. I think it also needs both parts of the claim to be reasonably confirmed, unless there’s really strong proof that one of them happened and it was clearly rigged. If ABC comes out and says “We didn’t give the questions but we did intentionally only fact check Trump”, I would count that as a YES.